SONGSOPTOK: It seems that fear is the most important primal instinct in the animal
world. The two main manifestations of fear in the human society is centered
around two entities: God(s) and Demons. We somehow learn to fear ghosts and
spirits at a very early age and remain marked by that fear later in life. What
is your personal experience? When did you start fearing ghosts and for what
reasons?
MITRA: As far as I can remember; when I was very
young; we were very often threatened by the elders in the name of JUJU; if we
did any mischief; we believed the Juju would catch us immediately; but, we
didn’t have any idea what exactly it was or what harm it actually could do to
us! But my first fear was Juju. There was another fear of “Chele-Dhora”… if children
went outside of the house alone or at a wrong time in the absence of guardians; we
knew a bad man would catch us and take us forever from our parents and family.
We might be turned into beggars or sacrificed to their causes. Then came the
fear of curse from god/ goddess and lastly, very little fear was left for
ghosts. I used to be afraid not only of ghosts and demons; but also of the
curse of gods and goddesses (“Thakur Pap debe”). Beating, scolding, calling
names by angry senior people of the joint family or neighborhood (in the name
of taking care and teaching moral things) and ridiculous and innovative
punishments from angry teachers of the school as a part of the lessons created
lots of fear, guilt and shame in my child-mind. ‘Do and don’t do’ were set for
us with very strict boundaries by all these sources. Rather, ghost stories or
fairy tales of big and small giants kept a broad spectrum of imaginations and
thrill (fight of the prince/ princes or the village boy/ girl ultimately
defeating the giants) beyond the periphery of fear. So, of all, the fear of getting
beaten, scolded, and punished affected me most. If fear did any damage in me,
it was never generated from ghosts and demons. I never took them seriously. It
was rather a curiosity, entertainment and fun for me. With my little
observations and intelligence; somehow I discovered that ghosts didn’t exist and
if they existed at all, they were not going to eat me, kill me, humiliate me or
punish me.
SONGSOPTOK: Very often adults try to
control the tantrums of children by threatening them with ghosts and spirits.
Do you remember any such incident when you were very young? In your opinion, do
such methods have a permanently negative effect on children? In what way?
MITRA: As I mentioned just now, only threat of
ghosts came to me from the adults was ‘JUJU’. They never described clearly
whether it was a tiger or bat or ghost; whether it had horns, tail, sharp teeth
or only one red eye in the middle of the forehead! I used to imagine it from
the latest ghost or fairy story I heard from them. I think I was one of the luckiest children
who didn’t face much threat directly or indirectly through stories, rituals and
ideas. Let me describe my only experience of real fear of ghost. In our house;
everyone in the three storied building had to cross a long open terrace in
order to reach the toilets lying at the corner of the first floor. When I was very young and had to go there
alone after the sunset, I used to get really afraid of ghosts, as if some were
sitting in the visible huge trees and moving the branches vigorously with their
long, thick, branchlike legs. I used to run into one of the toilets and run
back through the dark terrace to reach the main corridor of the first floor.
But I didn’t seriously believe that; rather I indulged myself to enjoy the cold
and shivering feeling! Our uncles and some cousins were seriously very afraid
of those trees (inhabited by ghosts) and never used to go there alone. I knew
this fear was baseless; but liked to hold the imagination and feeling for some time,
may be a year. But when I started to go to school; somehow I found much more
interesting and fascinating things to attend than to be trapped in the
imagination of ghosts. I can’t say about permanency of any negative feeling or
practice; rather I deny it. And I also deny the chance of permanent fear from
ghosts and demons. As far as life is concerned, there are many ways to overcome
any threat, constraint, restraint or fear. But yes, of course any kind of
threat in any form, even the ghost stories, tales about demons and fierce creatures,
do affect a child’s mental set up; especially if, in course of growing up to an
adult, mature person, the child does not get enough and constant exposures in
the form of love, empathy, courage, trust, education, experience, success and
so on... The bigger and deeper the fear, the greater the risk or chance of
mental weaknesses and more fights and problems a person has to face to overcome
them. Fear is the root of almost all weaknesses and vices a person suffers
from. To get defensive, he/she becomes offensive or manipulative and
channelizes the fear through a series of negative maneuvers and activities. Some
real helplessness might result which need professional intervention. But, I
don’t think ghost stories are responsible for generating such long lasting
fear. I would rather say that the horror and violence in movies, stories and video
games do a greater and long lasting damage not only to a child, but to an adult
too! Though I am not very sure – it could be fear or anger, which is the source
of violence, but also some deep rooted sense of insecurity, fear and sadism
might be there!
SONGSOPTOK: Not only do we frighten
children with ghosts, we often entertain them with ghost stories. When children
learn to read, grown-ups often try to incite them to get into the habit of
reading by buying ghost stories. What do you think of this practice?
MITRA: I am against horror and violent stories /movies.
Ghost stories are just made up stories; while some of them are really fearful;
some are very funny and there are lots of ghosts (as I read) who are friendly,
protectors and problem solvers. Like
magic, ghost story creates some illusion, which everyone knows not happening
really! Some recent Bengali movies on the existence of ghost mostly belong to
these categories. Sudden fear and surprise are very usual and primitive
feelings of ours…. stories based on them are attempts to express those feelings
and a story is always colored, winged, folded and twisted to create new taste
and emotion. I think they are not serious and feeling threatened by ghost
stories is a threat which comes from other kind of insecurity. I myself is not
very fond of ghost stories; I usually don’t buy one or present somebody. But if I didn’t read any ghost story at all,
how could I find some classic and marvelous stories like ‘Bhushundir mathe’ by
Rajshekhar Basu, ‘Le Lullu’ by Trailakyanath Mukhopadhyay, ‘Monihara’ by
Rabindranath Tagore. In fact, the presentation of fear always spurs me to take up
the challenge to get more courageous. Sense of fear only makes me ashamed of a
limitation that I have to overcome with knowledge and courage.
SONGSOPTOK: Adolescence is normally
the period when we start asking questions about different things. Did you start
asking questions about the existence of ghosts? Will you share the details with
us?
MITRA: First of all, even in childhood, I was never
afraid of ghosts. I read those books for thrill, different taste and feeling - mostly
fun. I heard and read lots of ghost stories but each of them appeared to me as
a non serious story with its unique taste, color, stunt and twist.... they
generated no bad effects or harm in me. I don’t believe ghost stories could ever
make an otherwise normal child into a timid, cowardly or disturbed human being.
Who didn’t and don’t read ghost stories?
Are all of them or most of them or even some of them suffering from serious
fear in their adulthoods? If an adult person has fear of ghost, he or she must
have other sources of trauma in their childhood I think.
SONGSOPTOK: A lot of people claim to
have direct experience of ghosts or other inexplicable phenomena. Do you have
any such experience to share with us? Or experiences of people you know?
MITRA: NO
! I heard many stories from many persons about their direct experience (or
experience of some ones they know) of seeing ghosts. But we all knew at the
same time, those were told in a gathering with the purpose of passing leisure time , to create some special effect and
ambience on a rainy or dark night, to keep awake during the night on long drives. I appreciated - the
stories were very interesting (creating lots of attention) and the purposes
were served well. That’s it! I could write here a story about how I feared
about ghosts when I was forty two years old, a mother of two young girls but
how I got a full explanation of my scary imaginations.
SONGSOPTOK: It is true that most of us
like reading or watching films about ghosts, spirits or mysterious phenomena.
Do you enjoy these things too? Can you think of a specific story or a film that
really thrilled you? Do you have any favorite writers of this genre?
MITRA: No,
I don’t. I don’t get any enjoyment from them; my choice and passion for art and
literature are entirely different. I still read fairy tales and may be also
ghost stories (and watch one or two new or special kind of scary movie) if some of my reliable sources recommend.
But, most of the time, they do not fascinate me so much to try another. Bottom
line is, neither am I interested in ghost nor in scary or flowery stories of
blind religion and faith. I may enjoy a ghost story and movie once in a while;
but never enjoy made up religious stories of gods and demons.
SONGSOPTOK: Many of us think that
science still has to go a long way to explain everything that we experience on
earth. Science has enlightened us about a lot of things, but there are certain
areas that can be considered as the twilight zone – the breeding place for the
uncanny and the preternatural. What are your thoughts about this?
MITRA: There are two types of unknown; one is yet to
understand and discover (the journey of Science and exploring new and unknown horizons
is still going on -- human race is evolving everyday) and the other is blind
faith : for whatever reason, when someone chooses not to accept, search or wait
for the actual explanations which already exist and choose to stick to that
blindness and blind faith. I have still so many things to know and experience what
mankind already opened up; I feel no urge or interest in the dark supernatural
things. If I watch any of these show in
TV or get a book of this type; I used to leave them after a short while. Not
for any opposite belief or opinion; just for finding them boring. Not my cup of
tea. Not my subject to discuss; as I am
unaware and disinterested on this issue. Rather, my awareness stops me and
takes me to different areas which gives positive vibes and pleasures to me.
SONGSOPTOK: We find it difficult to
accept that nothing remains after death, which often leads us to imagine the
supernatural. We are naturally attracted to what lies beyond the known everyday
world. What is your opinion about this? Do you think that everything ends with
death? Or is it because since we don’t really know that we oscillate between
belief and doubt?
MITRA: If
I am in doubt about anything; I try to approach professionals and mainly
research the subject on existing information, through internet. If I don’t get
any answer; I prefer to keep it aside and wait for my next search rather than
to go for any readymade alternative and false theories and beliefs. I have
unlimited things yet to know about life; don’t find any eagerness to go for
this research. Let the interested and professional people explore and find it;
I could wait for the result. I am curious and hard working on what could be
solved but I am lazy and reluctant about the issues which are beyond my long
earned knowledge, interest and capacity. I am not an ignorant or arrogant, I
always give space to research and people who are focused on different direction
and if the result makes sense to me; I accept. Whatever I gather or read about
the journey beyond death or reincarnation; it gives me the pleasure of reading
a story; yes, like ghost stories. The bottom line is; I have no idea whether
life ends in death or there is another journey beyond death. Not my cup of tea again.
SONGSOPTOK: Almost all societies
believe that the entities that exists in the realms that are beyond our
understanding and our sensory perceptions possess an immense amount of power.
But the capacity of humans is limited. So why does humans believe that the
souls of the dead are immensely powerful? What, according to you, is the reason
for this?
MITRA: No idea, honestly. Unaware in this subject.
SONGSOPTOK: As we grow more and more
dependent on science and technology, it is possible that our belief in the
supernatural will grow weaker with time. In that sense ghosts and other
entities are likely to have a very dark future indeed. But wouldn’t that
deprive us of a whole range of feelings and emotions? Wouldn’t we become poorer
in our sensations? What is your opinion?
MITRA: I
don’t find any threat from knowing the fact, reality and truth. Those will go side by side. As long as man
does not stop hearing, reading, watching and get rid of emotions and
sensations, there will be readers of ghost stories and fairy tales. I am not
talking about the horror and violent literature and art. Let them go (but,
could we?) The real threat is, as I realize how many readers are there now and
will be in future? How many are reading these universally well circulated
webzines and books, old books? The globe has turned into a market place.
Everything is salesmanship. Anything could be sold, whether right or wrong,
true or false, ethical or unethical, Science or beliefs, war or peace. We are
trying to keep into the positive sides of everything; but if there is a war, we
don’t know who will win. We are just solders if not puppets.
MITRA GHOSH CHATTOPADHYAY: An ex Scientist of India (worked for
20 years) in the field of Geological Science with degrees from India, UK and
Canada. At present, She lives in Canada and India, she is a writer (mostly in
Bengali), working as an editor and publisher of a magazine ( Prabhas) and a
publication (Sohojiya Prakashoni). Two
books, few short stories and many travel articles are published. Besides
writing, travel/ globetrotting and photography are her passions.
We sincerely
thank you for your time and hope we shall have your continued support.
Aparajita
Sen
(EDITOR)
Songsoptok
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